Some of you may be curious as to what is going on with Section 6. Some of the season ticket holders around Section 6 will know by now.

Section 6 is not an organisation as such, it is a loose collective, we do have principles and we have had some good successes in the past. But currently we have a difficult situation, a situation which emphasises one of the key campaigns that we have been working on from inception.

Suppose you are aged 16, you support Town, and away from home enjoy singing at football, because in away sections the singers coexist with the non-singers and families. But you are 16 to 21, you can drive probably drink and undoubtedly have outgrown the sanitised atmosphere of the family areas or even the Sir Bobby Robson Upper Tier.

So, what are your options? You currently have a season ticket that costs somehere between £159 to £250 a season, or you may buy tickets by the game at a cost of £18 per game. But you want a ticket in the Lower Tier of the Sir Bobby Robson Stand, the cost of a new season ticket is £200 more than you pay currently and you cannot afford that. Match tickets are £28 per game, again an extra £10 per game or £230 per season.

Now very few young students aged 16 to 21 can afford an extra £200 a season, those in sixth form or FE college get no grants and either beg money off parents or work part time. Neither scenario is likely to give them the extra £200 per season. University students are also just as badly off, even if they can afford the £200 they will pay it off for the rest of their working lives.

So how do other clubs deal with this? Well, from looking at just 10 of our fellow Championship clubs they seem to all offer either a student concession price or a youth (aged 16 to 21) price match tickets and season tickets in their main supporting stands, only Forest seem to differentiate between sections of stands and not offering such a ticket in some areas.

So what about our Ipswich supporter, he has to sit amongst the kids or the non-singers in the Upper Tier, because he is priced out of where he really wants to be which is the Lower SBRS.

This is the dilemma facing the next generation of supporters, not you if you are aged over 21, you probably have a season ticket or can afford as often as possible a home ticket. But the next generation are supposedly forced to sit in silence in the other areas of the ground, not stand and sing as they would like to.

I would imagine if they did this until that age they would stop following Ipswich, stop buying tickets and as the SBRS Lower gets older there will be no new generation to replace them. In 15 years time the sound of Thermos flasks opening will be louder than the singing. Most SBRS Lower fans will be greyer than me.

But fortunately some of these fans had found another way, they buy their Upper Tier ticket or season ticket and sneak in the Lower Tier.

Which takes me back to Section 6. Bunch of kids I hear some of the most miserable readers snigger, or are they actually the future of the Ipswich Town support, the future passionate supporters who sing all game. Most supporters of whatever age were once a teenager, then of course price was not an issue, ticket prices were always reasonable and this situation never arose.

But enter Mr Killjoy in the shape of the stewards, we can see it is an orchestrated plan, check every ticket in Section 6 to ensure that these teenagers are excluded by price from where they want to be to support their club. It is now so extreme that an adult season ticket holder in his 30s was grilled and his season ticket studied closely yesterday.

So the stewards have had their way and Section 6 is merely those of us who can afford to pay full price adult tickets (or at my age have no choice). That is not to say we don't sing anymore, yesterday I was told by a fan I didn't know from Section 5, unprompted, that almost all the songs that the SBRS Lower sang with such passion yesterday originated in Section 6 and there were only a dozen of us as well, thanks to all those in Section 6 that sang so well yesterday.

But we need a way forward, the only logical reason that the club has rejected calls for a youth/student ticket option (even number limited if needs be as an experiment) is down to the accountants, the club want to squeeze as much dosh out of us fans as possible.

But we will not give up. We have raised a second petition here:

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/studentticketnorthstandlower

If what I say strikes a chord then please sign it.

If on the other hand snigger and you laugh at it, then consider this, if you sing at football what you do in the situation of our hypothetical fan who cannot afford £200, what did you do in your youth remembering of course that tickets cost far more of a pay packet these days than then. Stop laughing and think about it, will you stop going when there is no next generation to take up the mantle and sing, "Hark now Hear..."

TheDalaiFarmer added 03:36 - Oct 4 The most pathetic whinge in the history of TWTD. The simple solution would be for you and your 16-21 year old band of fools to move to the other end of the ground (Churchmans lower), grow some balls, and actually get near the away fans if you want to create some atmosphere. You've got the option. Stop whinging like a spoilt child and use it.
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Greybritain added 03:48 - Oct 4 An excellent post CITB.
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trueblue1970 added 06:49 - Oct 4 A bit strong Dali !!, why not set up in the upper Sir Bobby, its louder than the Lower already
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CaughtInTheBrambles added 08:10 - Oct 4 A bit strong!!!! FYI Dalai We considered Churchmans and asked the club to look into it. The Police and Safety Officer said No. Two reasons, too near the away fans, they like the current situation where the away fans and lower SBRS have no banter at all, it is sanitised and safe. Clegg investigated moving the Away fans to the other end of the Cobbold but this was rejected by the Police. The other reason is that Standing is not tolerated in the Lower Churchmans. The option is not there basically. The Upper Tier is no use because although the acoustics are much much better you are not allowed to stand, no standing means no singing. Here is a quote from one of our loudest "members" on his exile to the Upper Tier on Saturday "One thing leeds taught me was that when I was in the upper tier (I havent left lower tier since a few games before the the sheffield game where S6 was started almost 2 years) I felt dead inside. I was waiting for half time. I'd rather not go to football than SIT at a match in silence and it took 45 minutes of doing just that to remind me how much atmosphere plays a part in my saturday and tuesday nights. If we dont get student prices and it stays impossible to sneak in, then S6 will be reduced to Naaaridge at home (when I can justify the upgrade) and other big games. we really need to start badgering the club relentlessly as to why they are trying to stifle the life out of PR. If we are persistent then eventually they will have to give us an answer."

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InterBlue added 08:53 - Oct 4 A 16-18 can't earn an extra £200 a year from a part time job if needed? Give over! Crikey your lads are dedicated! Blubtastic.
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CaughtInTheBrambles added 09:09 - Oct 4 At the current minimum wage that is over 50 hours at £3.94 an hour. Bear in mind that as we all know working costs money in travel, lunch etc. so probably 60 or 70 hours.
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wildblue added 09:16 - Oct 4 I've got a radical idea which you might want to consider. But please don't rush in - it's really really risky. GET A JOB. There is nothing like learning the value of something as opposed to the cost. I'm in my 30's now, pay for 4 season tickets (family now...) each year and as many away games as I can fit in. I can afford it, it's not an issue. But from the age of 13 / 14 I've paid for my own season tickets. From about 14 to 16 I worked the morning shift in Littlewoods cafe in town, clearing tables from teenagers who would make as much mess as possible. It was rank, poorly paid and I hated every minute. But I just had time to bike home, grab a shower and a change of clothes and get down to Portman Road. I financed my own football in the lower North Stand. No work = no football. So why don't you stop whining, grow a pair and get a job. Lot's of students appear to get paid to go to sixth form / college anyhow... However - I do like the idea of getting some atmosphere back into the ground....anything that would encourage that is good.

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Cr0wman added 10:06 - Oct 4 As someone who stands central in section 5 of SBR lower, I must correct you. As with most games, on Saturday equal amount of chants were started to my right (section 4) behind me (section 5) and to my left (section 6) .. Please stop suggesting that you are the only area of noisy supporters and as such deserve special treatment!!! The world seems unfair to you now, but in 10 years time will you be wanting a cheap ticket because the baby needs new clothes and the missus will not let you spend £450 on a season ticket?

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jayessess added 10:07 - Oct 4 so wait a second, you like the idea of getting some atmosphere back into the ground, but you're opposed to getting more young people in the part of the stadium that makes most of the noise? Part of what working does is teach you the value of money, nobody is going to be mug enough to fork out two hundred quid more than necessary for an ST, especially given that the SBRS Lower are technically the worst seats in the stadium (ie. the cheapest adult tickets, with the worst view). What the hell is the motivation for not giving discounts to younger people with less disposable income?

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InterBlue added 10:18 - Oct 4 Not working I'm afraid, times are tough but I'd be embarrassed if my lad grew up to tell me there was something he really wanted but that he couldn't graft £200 quid extra over the course of a year.
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Steve_M added 10:26 - Oct 4 There are two issues here and conflating them is rather weak: 1) Is the club's pricing policy right? With the exception of season ticket holders on a discounted ticket then possibly not. 2) Should the club enforce it's policy and ensure people sit where they have purchased a ticket for? Of course they should and not just for financial reasons either. Letting too many people into the lower tier of the ground presents a possible safety risk. The outrage at the club ensuring that people are in the correct area of the stand is ridiculous. It's also worth noting that Section 6 would gain more sympathy without trying to pretend they are the only people interested in having an atmosphere in the ground. In general they have been a welcome addition but the implied sense of superiority to the mere mortals around them grates a bit. And as for the bloke who couldn't stand being in the Upper Tier, just man up a bit, that is quite pathetic.

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BasingstokeBranch added 10:32 - Oct 4 What nonsense. The way to encourage new generations of supporters is through ticket deals for kids/families and success on the pitch, not through subsidising students who already have the option of cheaper tickets elsewhere in the ground. And quite frankly I'd be disappointed if the club didn't remove supporters who had dishonestly purchased tickets to sit elsewhere in the ground.

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huddersfielditfc added 11:02 - Oct 4 Bloody hell these responses are depressing.
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ihatenorwich added 11:15 - Oct 4 Why can't you ask the ground if a small section of the Sir Bobby upper tier can be available for standing, as theres a lot of space in the corner of the Sir Bobby upper tier. This way you can try and generate more atmosphere in the upper tier and around the ground.
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BasingstokeBranch added 11:24 - Oct 4 There's no way that the club will acknowledge that they allow standing in any part of the ground as this contravenes the Football Offences Act 1991.
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Norwichbeater added 11:24 - Oct 4 I have no problems with section 6. However u didn't instigate the rest of the north stand singing the leeds fans did. I am in section 5 and i didnt hear much from section 6 on saturday. We need the away fans to be near the north stand if we want a decent atmosphere again. It wont happen though the police have made sure of that.
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ihatenorwich added 11:54 - Oct 4 I'm a student and i think its perfectly acceptable for the stewards to kick us out as we have not payed the full price like other people, what we should do is all the students who want to sing group together and sit upstairs and voice the songs that the lower sing.
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CaughtInTheBrambles added 12:16 - Oct 4 Several points First to allay a simple and common misnomer the the Football Offences Act 1991 does not in any of it's parts ban standing in seated areas, it is merely the interpretation of the act and the way the FLA enforce it. One minister could change it with a few words in Parliament. Secondly the argument that 15 years ago when they were a teenager their part-time job paid for their season ticket ignores the obvious fact that football ticket inflation has far exceeded wage inflation, therefore direct comparison is very difficult if ticket prices had been at the same value in real terms then how long would you have had to work, unless you have payslips and ticket stubs difficult to assess. Get a Job - er yes thankyou Mr Cameron didn't know you posted on here. Graft an extra £200 is almost as bad, football supporters come from all classes and live all over the place, opportunities are therefore varied some will have lots of skills and talents and be able to earn some extra money some will have no such opportunities, a great oversimplification of how society (big, small or broken) works. As for Saturday, I genuninely ran into an old school North Stander who unprompted made the comment that most of the chants came from Section 6. One odd thing about the SBRS Lower is that if you start a chant it takes ages to traverse the lower tier if at all and often will come back from Section 4 or 5 like a very delayed echo, when we may be on a completely different chant by then. So it is difficult to measure where a chant starts with such appalling acoustics.

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sonian_blue added 13:01 - Oct 4 Cant believe the arguing amongst our own fans. For what its worth I see no problem with moving to a more expensive area if the seats are empty. If it generates more noise then I am all for it and as previously mooted on here I believe we are too expensive to watch for the casual fan. That is the reason our attendance is pretty much the same every weeek plus the away crowd. I suggest we will not even fill the place when the scum visit. We all agree that cheaper seats = bigger crowd = more noise but we still price people out of the ground.

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huddersfielditfc added 13:13 - Oct 4 Good post sonian_blue. Ideally Section6 would not be stuck out in the corner where we are, but sadly it is the only place we have reasonable space for flags , and are allowed to stand. Moving centrally in the North lower has been mooted, but it still doesnt stop the problem of being priced out.
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olimar added 14:11 - Oct 4 I agree entirely with Steve_M. The club offer a discount structure for many groups of society, but the expectation that the discount structure should allow you to sit anywhere you want to is completely deluded. Are the club to allow families to sit in the SBR Stand, because they think their sons would like the atmosphere better than in the seats at the front of Cobbold? Should the unemployed be allowed to buy a seat in the middle of the Cobbold because the view is better? Of course not. The club have every right to limit the discounts to the areas of the ground where the demand is less. Particularly because in the case of a big game, the seats which will fill up first are those in SBR Stand lower. And they need to be consistent in that. This entire issue is focussed on the misconception within the "Section 6 collective" that they are in some way the only possible saviours of ITFCs atmosphere, and therefore need to be able to circumvent the rules in this instance for the very future of the club. The irony of all this is that this blog, suggesting Section 6 are being restricted from doing what they need to do, was posted the day after the Leeds game. Which many have generally accepted was the best atmosphere at Portman Road for a while.

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I_8_NARWICH added 15:39 - Oct 4 I complety agree with you CITB I am a student and i have a season ticket in the Northstand upper, and i find it frustrating that i have to pay adult prices to sit in section 6 (which i simply cannot afford) where it is a such better atmosphere than anywhere else in the ground, thats why i enjoy going to the away games, such better atmosphere than home games- apart from saturday the whole place was rocking then.

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05Jchamb added 19:38 - Oct 4 As a student I think the current situation is rediculous. The club have said that they do not want to change the price structure of NSL as it is an "adult environment" This is completely fair. Just as there are family areas for those that want to watch the game in that sort of environment (a thing that this club does brilliantly) there should also be adult environments. However, the moment you turn from an U16 to a student, the club F***'s you over royally with its huge prices. Back to the environment point. I could still be 21 and classed as a student. At 21 I am deffinately old enough to partake in an adult environment. At 17 I would consider myself old enough to partake in some adult environments and I have never seen anything in any of my games in the NSL that has shocked me or heard anything that I had not heard before elswhere. On top of this, the club has no problem with younger children in that stand as long as they can afford the ticket. On the subject of money: Some of you say "I paid for my season ticket when I was 14-15" I say to you well done (no sarcasm) Me too since the age of 13 and with all due respect, as previously mentioned; comparitively, its a hell of a lot more expensive than it used to be. Also some so wonderfully say "get a job" or "find the money" I do not come from a wealthy family and I have to save what I do get to be able to afford next years season ticket (as well as anything else I may want in that 12 months) I do have a job (although many are not as fortunate as the majority of student jobs have been taken by adults made redundent, which isnt necessarily unfair) Also my sixth form say im only allowed to work 10 hours a week which I already do. so unfortunately its not as simple as some on here would like to think.

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KembleBlue added 20:34 - Oct 4 Find all the negativity baffling, as I do the idea that the rest of SBR consider S6 to have put themselves on a pedastal.. this is simply not the case, nor do they consider themselves 'the saviours' in my opinion. This has been deflected upon them by keyboard warriors on here unfortunatly. We all agree the accoustics are terrible in NSL and have been ever since the rebuild which is a shame but cannot be changed. The simple fact is that the majority of the stands are too shallow in rows for chants to succesfully catch on. Alot of the time, S6 start a song (i sit between 5 and 6) which catches on but then if a chant comes in from 5 they frequently adopt that song but it does appear to then be too late - again just the situation we're faced with. My point (yeah it took me that long to get there!) is this as someone has previously mentioned, Price discrimination is usally done on some basis, at football this is usually views or facilities. Both are pretty crap from NSL - there really is no reason to make this Adults only. Further, it is the cheapest adults section? Why? Presumably because the view and facilities (and Beer) is so crap compared to other sections in the ground. So why price discriminate in this section unless the sole reason is they BELIEVE they can charge people more for the sake of it and have therefore made it Adult only. Why adult only? you cant smoke, drink, swear or even stand in this section, so by what basis can you justify it? Finally, the economics degree comes in - Price discrimination is only succesful.. bugger, what was it now.. something along the lines of on premium basis and if you can seperate your markets. There is no premium to the NSL seats, and clearly you cannot seperate NSL and NSU if the entrance are the same etc So why does it matter to people here to come on and moan at citb? He's simply asking that students (all over 18) be given a break, what difference does it make to you - why couldnt you just have signed the petition unless you have a personal chip on your shoulder?

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GiveusanI added 07:50 - Oct 5 I signed the petition. Our prices are too expensive especially for students who should have the right to be in the SBRS lower. Nothing worse than being in a sterile environment. It is time supporters and the club took seriously the problem of the muted atmosphere and low attendances at Portman Road.
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